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Wednesday, April 27, 2005

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Janet Salter

Fantastic job...thanks so much...did you send a copy to Cokie?

ELC

"Cokie is typical of liberal/progressive Catholics in that she sees nearly everything in terms of power, status, and politics." Just like the good little Marxoids they really are.

Mark Brumley

I'm not sure what motivates Cokie in particular, but scrutiny of many prominently "Catholic" media people's reaction to Benedict XVI suggests that many of them dislike the criticism or ridicule orthodox Catholicism inevitably generates among secularists and liberals. Why can't we have a pope, they seem to say, who won't embarrass us among our colleagues?

But let's give them the benefit of the doubt and suppose they genuinely have difficulty with certain aspects of Catholic teaching. Then we can ask them, "Why do you bother to associate yourself publicly with the Catholic Church, given that you object to so many of her teachings?"

That's not an invitation to leave; it's an invitation to self-reflection. Maybe before people go out of their way to associate themselves with a community of people or to continue to associte themselves they should ask themselves what such an association implies. Do I really believe what the Catholic Church stands for? If not, is there a question of dishonesty in labeling myself a Catholic?

The Catholic view of faith is communitarian, not individualistic. But communitarian faith doesn't deny the necessity of the personal declaration of "I believe" simply because that credo is joined (or should be) to others' profession into a unity that declares, "We believe". In other words, he who cannot honestly say, "I believe," cannot honestly say, "We believe."

Patrick Coulton

I would disagree with the analysis that Cokie is Marxist. I think it is more reasonable to compare her to a consumerist.

Like any good consumer she want the product to be palpable. She wants to have more choices and she wants the price to be low, possibly free (she learned this from the Sacred Heart nuns). If the market can not supply her desires she will have to look elsewhere. She does not say this directly but she hints that while she has continued to be faithful many have gone astray. She worries that she is being cheated, not getting full value for her money.

Of course Cokie has reason to feel cheated. No one listens to her.
Poor dear. No one listens to me, either. I wonder if I can get TV show?

Patrick Coulton

I would disagree with the analysis that Cokie is Marxist. I think it is more reasonable to compare her to a consumerist.

Like any good consumer she want the product to be palpable. She wants to have more choices and she wants the price to be low, possibly free (she learned this from the Sacred Heart nuns). If the market can not supply her desires she will have to look elsewhere. She does not say this directly but she hints that while she has continued to be faithful many have gone astray. She worries that she is being cheated, not getting full value for her money.

Of course Cokie has reason to feel cheated. No one listens to her.
Poor dear. No one listens to me, either. I wonder if I can get a TV show?

William Woods

In an odd way, the discontents of Cokie and of those like her give (unintentional) testimony to the truth. Whenever I read or hear such grumblings, I at once go to the object of their criticism in search of some truth they find grating on their sensibilities. The various reactions are something like those prompted by looking at a crucifix: the devout will meditate at least briefly on a mystery; those outside the faith will recoil in the face of a perceived needless unpleasantness.

We do well to remember that no human has ever led another human to the truths of faith by his own power. In saner ages, it was a given that prayer was the only sure way to win over (or win back) the lost. Let us keep Cokie and her spiritual fellow travelers in our prayers.

Brian Pessaro

Cokie has been immersed in Beltway politics for too long and that is the only prism through which she can see anything including her faith.

She was on Nightline shortly after PBXVI was elected, and she was moaning about how "Vatican II said we are the People of God," yada yada yada. Of course, had she bothered to read "Salt of the Earth" she would have realized that the term "People of God" is a biblical term for the Jewish people. What characterized them as the People of God was not personal autonomy, but turning to God and submitting to the Torah. As baptized Christians, we are grafted onto the family tree of God's people and what makes US the people of God is our submission to Christ and to His Church.

Cokie needs to get some Vitamin B16!!

Ann Applegarth

Oh, Carl, I do hope that she reads this!
I wonder if she knows how far she has
drifted from the Catholicism of her family?

Arthur Williamson

What's the point of Cokie's Catholicism? Benedict said it (referring to those adrift in a sea of relativism) just before the conclave - to validate personal desires and opinions.
As Catholics we (try to) follow a different Way, Truth and Life, One that does all things in obedience to the Father.
Lord, help me to be more faithful to You in Your Church.

jennifer

I think Cokie has the same problem with a lot of other "Catholics" I know who harbor complete falsehoods about the Church and think that they know better. When I joined the Church the sheer number of these people bowled me over and I wondered what nest of vipers I had stumbled into. When I discuss the Church with these people their very palpable hatred of the Church always makes me ask why they stay in an organization they so disagree with and find so repugnant. The usual answer is: "Well, it's MY church too!" I then gently remind them that technically, it's Christ's church.
Jennifer

JohnG

I think Cokie's initial comments are telling: The Pope lacks authority unless those he governs assent to his role. This is the secular view held towards our government, *only with the consent of the governed*, and many Protestant and Jewish congregations.

The people get to vote. If the people don't accept the ruler, he's out. If the congregation doesn't care for the words spoken by the Pastor/Rabbi, he's replaced.

Perhaps being married to a man outside the Catholic faith and being so intimately involved in the management of a secular government for so long, has changed the color of the prism through which she views everything around her, including the faith into which she was born.

One can pray for her return.

Maxine Quitiquit

I am so elated, excited, thrilled to hear someone speak their mind and heart and soul!! After the constant bombardment with politically correct and progressive statements by anyone with a public voice on any and all subjects related to Jesus Christ, the outdated and hopelessly archaic Catholic Church and the newly elected dictator in Rome, it is so refreshing, a big breath of fresh air!!!! Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

James Brady

Outstanding, Carl!!! You know I feel my blood pressure rise anytime I read such seething opinions from media moguls like Cokie Roberts.

But, a revelation of sorts came over me. As I was reading the article in my local paper (I had to really force myself after seeing the headline)I began to see something. I realized that everything she said about the pope is what I love about the Church! YES!!!! Her arguements were so infantile and intellectually bankrupt that it was laughable. Sadly there are many of the uninformed who buy off on this drivel.

But, thanks to you, Carl and those like you, orthodoxy has returned in force!

God Bless you and your apostolate
James Brady
Gering, NE

Anthony Deppe

Classic work, Carl.

"Eye has not seen, ear has not heard......"

Poor Cokie. I'd say, too much leftist, greeney bunkum from her spiritually corrupt education and lifestyle.

We have them in Australia, too. Interesting how our power-obsessive secular society tends to breed them.

Take comfort, Cokie, that one never looses their faith.....it just goes on holiday. You're welcome back to the real Church anytime.....on Jesus' conditions !!! (oops...or Pope Benedict's)

God bless,
Anthony Deppe
Newcastle
Australia

Paul

Carl,

Well said!

Kevin McGuire

I could not agree More with the answers given to Cokie and her husband recently-------There was a beautiful program with an interview on Channel 2 ----T. V. Ontario in which the expart in the study of our Church showed the novel The DeVinci Code for the fraud it is-----------------while egreeing with some of the historical data he disected the falacies and conclusions the Author used--is this book really designed to make us better Catholics-I was never so proud of this learned theologin.

Sue Manfred

While I was heartened to see Cokie's and Steve's sadly erroneous conclusions and thoughts refuted so admirably I was saddened by the disdainful and mean-spirited tone of your response. I am glad there are thoughtful and prayerful people who can see the error of this type of thinking and have the intellectual ability to debate so skillfully. But must we belittle and ridicule those whose reasoning and faith we find lacking? I cannot believe the attitudes I find prevalent in your "fisking" and in some of the responses in the blog will go far towards helping souls who need our prayers and love to find Jesus.

Linda

"There is an ideology that fundamentally traces all existing institutions back to power politics. And this ideology corrupts humanity and also destroys the Church. Here is a very concrete example: If I see the Church only under the aspect of power, then it follows that everyone who doesn't hold an office is ipso facto oppressed. And then the question of, for example, women's ordination, as an issue of power, becomes imperative, for everyone has to be able to have power. I think that this ideology, which suspects that everywhere and always what's at stake is basically power, destroys the feeling of solidarity not only in the Church but also in human life as such. It also produces a totally false point of view, as if power in the Church were an ultimate goal. As if power were the only category for explaining the world and the communion present in it. After all, we are not in the Church to exercise power as if we were in some kind of association. If belonging to the Church has any meaning at all, then the meaning can only be that it gives us eternal life, hence, real life, true life as such. Everything else is secondary. If that isn't true, then all "power" in the Church - which then sinks to the level of a mere association - is nothing more than an absurd "spectacle". I think we have to escape from this theology of power and this reduction that derives from Marxist suspicion." Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, 1996.

Amen.

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